SUO: Opposition to Motion
At 02:08 2001-07-23 -0700, Robert Grayson Spillers wrote:
>
> Frank Farance wrote:
>
> > On 2001-07-06 in the SUO P&P committee, which you chair, I reminded the committee (if they didn't know already) that standards participation is considered "work for hire" under the Copyright Act, i.e., IEEE owns the copyright of our work. So this contribution, if adopted, will belong to SUO WG and not its original submitters. In other words, whether or not Cyc, Teknowledge, etc., charge fees for their products is of no consequence to IEEE: if SUO WG adopts this work, then the contribution is controlled/developed by the SUO WG (operating under the Computer Society and IEEE Standards Association).
>
> > We are all individuals in the IEEE, so our company affiliations (from an IEEE P&P) aren't significant, i.e., Teknowledge can't make a motion, but an individual can (who has no requirements to represent their employer/organization).
> RGS: The paragraph you quote above does not discuss either work for hire or copyright. The point is that a flawed intellectual approach that duplicates a much better engineered existing product is not suitable for a standard. I also point out that neither is the commercial product suitable for a standard.
>
> RGS: As a matter separate from the quote above, I believe others will be interested in your comments. May I interpret the import of your words to mean
>
> (1) That "work for hire" means something of economic value.
Disclaimer: I'm not an intellectual property attorney, so don't take this as legal advice ... please consult your own attorney.
[First, if you didn't understand this in the P&P subcomittee, it would have been nice if you asked the question 2.5 weeks ago, rather than waiting until now.]
I believe "work for hire" refers to the *relationship* between us worker bees and the copyright holder. I don't believe it implies economic value.
> (2) Should this resolution pass, is it your assertion that by the offer and acceptance of this document and and any subsequent "work for hire" all parties cede copyright (also something of value?) along with any other commercial rights to IEEE?
The parties are signing a copyright release, which means that IEEE may use their work (or derived work). It does not imply that the original submitter cedes copyright to their own original work or other works *they* derive from *their* original work (but are not the IEEE standard).
> (3) If the work being offered (or to be done in the future) is paid for by a private firm (in part or in whole) with or without public funding and the proposers do not have authority to cede these rights, how does the IEEE acquire them? If people are participating as individuals but are receiving remuneration for any part of their work from an employer (or anyone else) it would not be possible for them (as individuals) to pass these things of value to another party. They might be able to pass some portion that they claim as personal property but what exactly that is would be very problematical.
The members participate as individuals.
The copyright release is from the copyright holder to IEEE. This is likely to be from a company or organization. For example, I participate as Frank Farance, but if I were submitting a document, I would need my company's (Farance Inc.) permission, and an authorized representative (e.g., myself) would sign the release as an authorized representative of the company, not as a participant of SUO WG.
-FF
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